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Dear friends,

Welcome to my blog. I am honored to have you visit. I hope you'll find my articles a blessing. I welcome your input and especially comments and questions.

I write as a Christian from Jerusalem, Israel about Biblical subjects.

I am particularly interested in the subjects of children, families, women's issues, corporal punishment, science and nature as these subjects relate to the Holy Scriptures.

For more information, see my website: www.biblechild.com

With every good wish - Samuel Martin

Wednesday, April 02, 2014

"So you think corporal punishment/spanking/smacking is ok because you turned out fine: Think again"


So you think corporal punishment/spanking/smacking is ok because you turned out fine: 

Think again!

16 comments:

austin said...

This is one of thee most ridiculous articles I have ever read. What kind of person goes to such lengths to try to undermine what is totally reasonable and acceptable in the sight of our Lord Jesus? Why would someone lay as a foundation, to speak against corporal punishment, words that assume even conclude that these people that "spank" slash "smack" their children are all portraying themselves as "holier than thou"? You cite people and articles from such arrogant abuses of what has always been for me loving and appropriate discipline, and use these misguided people and their comments as a reason to set aside spanking a child, even if the loving use of this discipline is acceptable, allowable and even effective before God our Father. Do you see scripture railing as you do against the proper and loving use of corporal correction? Let me ask you some serious questions sir. When a Mom and Dad choose to put a child in "Time-out", who in their right mind would accuse that parent of child abandonment as they sit in a corner on a chair. If a parent sent their child to their room, who in their right mind would accuse those parents of unlawful imprisonment? Yet, whenever a loving parent makes the decision to spank their child on their bottom, for a reason they feel will not just curtail the wrong behavior, but "correct' it (and that's the long term goal for the betterment of the child not the parent) why would anyone ever conclude that these parents have "abused" their child or done something "wrong?" Could it be that they have struggled to find an answer to something that was never a problem with the Lord? Could it be, as you confessed, that in disagreeing with your Dad, or whoever, you finally found an answer (as you said yourself) to something that needed no answer. Yes, there are abuses, and yes some parents do the wrong thing. But if a parent yells loudly at a child inappropriately, do we start telling all parents that raising your voice is evil, wrong, not right, unlawful, unrighteous and must be avoided, abandoned and even spoken against? I remember screaming at the top of my lungs at my child . . . she was about to run out into the street and a car was coming, and she stopped immediately, in fact, I believe to this day, my voice saved her life. My friend, I spanked (smacked?) both my children as they were growing up, only when as a good and loving parent, decided it was an appropriate method needed to immediately teach a strong lesson and "correct" the behavior. It was my sovereign right and duty as a Dad, and in those few times I did it, never once, not for one second, did I do anything wrong before God. Stop hurting the ways of the Lord who wants good parents to lovingly discipline their children and at times, if they see fit, use loving corporal discipline on the children they love and care about. If it's chosen out of love, administered from love, and produces right behavior, it should not be viewed as something wrong or evil or inappropriate. Find another cause to decry that will keep evil, real evil at bay. Don't rail against good parents, who chose righteous and acceptable methods to lovingly guide the growth and behavior of their immature children to good and loving adults. I feel strongly you will not publish my comments, but they are aimed at you personally. I will pray that they are not heard in vain. May God give you a higher cause than preventing good parents from using righteous and acceptable discipline when they lovingly believe it is needed and appropriate. I am not holier than anyone, but I know the Lord is happy with the way I lovingly rewarded and punished my children because I wanted them to follow the ways of God. May God have mercy on our souls.

Samuel Martin said...

Hi and thanks for your inputs.

Please note that this post is a part of quite a large body of writing that I have done on this subject.

I can understand how you might evaluate this post as you have.

Perhaps you might consider reading some of my more foundational materials because this might help you better understand and contextualize where I am coming from.

The best place to start is with my free ebook - http://whynottrainachild.com/2013/06/22/download-martins-book/

Here is one review from only one scholar of my book and what I am doing - http://redemptivechristianity.com/?p=214

In closing, I just got this from a loving Christian dad who gave me a wonderful Palm Sunday present.

Talk about something to make your Palm Sunday - Just got this from a father of four - "I want begin by telling you I appreciate the fight you have waged on so many important topics. Your studies into corporal punishment helped convince my wife (and a reluctant me) of the need to gentle parent. It has done wonders for our family." - www.facebook.com/byblechyld

austin said...

So when Jesus turned over the tables in the temple he sinned? No, he had a righteous anger and He did the right thing as always. When a Dad, a Father, a Mother need to be stern (like the word rebuke, it's in the bible) they have every reason and right to not act as if somehow the fear it may bring to a child's mind is wrong. Gentleness is not a requirement when punishing a child. If gentleness were the goal in discipline the good Lord "who is holier than thou" would have said so. Reread Hebrews 12 when you have time and stop reading men's works that make you feel better about what you know nothing about. trust me, I know the hardest words to say for us are "I was wrong". We just continue to justify ourselves by claiming plain words were taken out of context. Or we send another man's view to bolster our feeling that we were right all along. here's the bottom line. BIBLE says that all discipline is painful (Hebrews 12) and that it brings about righteousness, and peace (gentleness in a child that is well trained when young). I stand by my original comments, and mostly because this assault against really good parents who willingly and lovingly spanked their children when it was appropriate had great kids that turned out very well, and should never be made to feel that it was I any way motivated by what you propose, but rather 100% love, which is what it is in many very good parenting homes that use it. If a Mother or father feels a lack of self control when they punish, that's not a spanking problem, that's a Mom and dad problem. Gentle parenting is simply our way of saying, 'It's hard for me at times to ever punish my child, so I will do what makes me feel better about what I do" . . . which does make you feel better, it must or you wouldn't use it. But I have never once considered what would make me feel better when choosing what was appropriate punishment for a child's behavior, and even when I spanked my child (rare, very rare) it was always for their benefit to correct the behavior. We can go back and forth about this but the proof is in my kids. they are living testimony to how I parented and at times chose to apply corporal punishment. My dad beat the you know what out of me when I was growing up. He actually knocked me out as a teenager. but he was a drinker and a non Christian. BUT I never believed that just because he was a violent physical man, that I was supposed to abandon the proper way to lovingly discipline my kids when and if they needed that form of discipline. I could have easily made excuses for setting aside corporal punishment because of the perverse way it was used against me. But I chose to prayerfully execute it when needed, and that was my right, my method and my joy, as I watched it help my kids make changes and grow up into very good adults. I am not holier than anyone, but my Lord is, and it is never hinted in scripture that all parents who used "the rod" (I never used nan object but my palm on a bottom) to correct, were somehow missing something he was teaching us. No, those scriptures that we try to treat as culturally irrelevant and archaic are full of wisdom and as relevant and useful as they were the moment they were written. I will end by saying, I loved my kids enough to not let my soft feelings and desire to never see them cry or be sad, get in the way of me being the best dad I could be, and I am thankful that the lord gave me the wisdom to overcome the temptation to be slack when it came to consistent and loving discipline . . . yes even, corporal discipline. May it continue to be lovingly administered. Love, always, Austin.
I don't always sound gentle in my emails . . . but my heart is in the right place. I trust you will know that I mean no harm, only help. John 3:30

Christina said...

Great writing. Another point is that when someone says they are better for being spanked it is to say "I would have been more evil and out of control and possibly a criminal if I were never spanked." It is completely ridiculous to believe that hitting another person develops good character.

austin said...

Hitting another person? That's like saying that God asking us not to murder and then he destroyed nations, did the wrong thing. Do you see the difference between "hitting a person" and lovingly applying corporal punishment when a sovereign parent believes it is needed and correctly applies it? Are you saying that putting a child in time out or sending them to their room builds character? The goal of punishment is to punish. The goal of spanking is to correct and change behavior. there is nothing evil about corporal punishment, but to the emotionally soft and those that would never want their child to feel pain or suffer at their hand in any way, do not complain when they refuse to obey you, or they grow up out of control, because you were making sure you didn't feel bad about correcting your child. I raised two kids to adulthood, and rarely spanked them, but when I did, it worked, and they were the better for being corrected. I didn't hit my children, anymore than you didn't abandon your child when you set them in a corner alone, or you didn't imprison your child when you sent them to their room. Spanking works, when applied out of love from a parent who is interested in training their child to behave, not interested in what will not cause their child any sadness or pain. Read Hebrews 12, and then try to argue with God about discipline. These comments about hitting are misguided and terribly foolish. Wisdom is justified by the children she bears. We shall se what happens . . . but if the holy scriptures are not opposed to corporal punishment, you might ask yourself, why am I?

Samuel Martin said...

Hi,

I would urge you to consider a view of a Christian father of four who read my free ebook.

http://samuelmartin.blogspot.co.il/2014/04/a-father-of-four-shares-his-journey.html

Thanks

Sam Martin

Anonymous said...

Quoting the Bible to defend your beliefs is the most non-convincing way to promote you argument. For anybody. On any thing. Why? Because every single person will find some quote, some where, that they "interpet" as supporting their view. This whole blog post is nothing but people saying "But, look at THIS line". Pointless.

Anonymous said...

So glad I'm not a Christian anymore. Don't have to deal with "God mandated" corporal punishment and I can just love my kids, letting them flourish. The home should be a place of security, a sanctuary. Not a place a child fears.

Anonymous said...

I am a new Christian and hence new to the bible .I have to admit that I was very close to leaving my faith until I read Samuel Martins blog.I have also read his credentials and trust in his in-depth knowledge of the Bible .Thanks to Samuel and his writings I have regained my faith in Christianity and Christians .
Thanks to the above post I just read Hebrews 12 .I dont see in that verse where we are encouraged to hit/spank our children .In fact I cant see how you could interpret that verse as a reason to hurt/ humiliate your child, I do see the word discipline ,as in disciple/ guide.
Also I have worked with children for almost 2 decades ,some with severe behavioral issues .I NEVER laid a finger on them in punishment ,in fact I dont believe in time-outs either because as you say its abandonment and I God doesn't abandon us when we mess up .ALL of my children (despite their challenges ) are wonderful ,respectful ,college grads (or college bond).
Samuel is a man of Grace and hence handles his debates like a gentle man ,he has not called anyone out of name ,unlike a previous poster .When the argument is lost the looser resorts to slander .

Anonymous said...

I am a new Christian and hence new to the bible .I have to admit that I was very close to leaving my faith until I read Samuel Martins blog.I have also read his credentials and trust in his in-depth knowledge of the Bible .Thanks to Samuel and his writings I have regained my faith in Christianity and Christians .
Thanks to the above post I just read Hebrews 12 .I dont see in that verse where we are encouraged to hit/spank our children .In fact I cant see how you could interpret that verse as a reason to hurt/ humiliate your child, I do see the word discipline ,as in disciple/ guide.
Also I have worked with children for almost 2 decades ,some with severe behavioral issues .I NEVER laid a finger on them in punishment ,in fact I dont believe in time-outs either because as you say its abandonment and I God doesn't abandon us when we mess up .ALL of my children (despite their challenges ) are wonderful ,respectful ,college grads (or college bond).
Samuel is a man of Grace and hence handles his debates like a gentle man ,he has not called anyone out of name ,unlike a previous poster .When the argument is lost the looser resorts to slander .

Christina said...

Sorry to hear it...it is God's mercy and grace that empowers me to show the same mercy and grace to my children. Those who teach violence against children deny the work of the cross and are workers destroying the body of Christ

Christina said...

Sorry to hear. Because of the mercy and grace shown me I am empowered to show mercy and grace. Punishment denies the work of the cross.

Anonymous said...

Austin, I am 100% on your side. To the others....having been spanked myself as a young child, I have never, ever walked about acting as if I am holier than thou, though I am thankful for the loving discipline my parents raised me with. The Bible teaches that we are all sinners (no one less or greater than the other). Doesn't matter if you were spanked or were not spanked; do spank or do not spank - all are equally as sinful at the foot of the cross. Being spanked has nothing to do with personal holiness or an attitude of self-righteousness. I find Mr. Martin's argument to this end quite distasteful.

If Mr. Martin feels that it is violence to administer the rod according to the principles laid out in Scripture, then it should be equally as horrible to take those Scriptures and change their definition and label all spanking as abuse and "smacking."

Samuel Martin said...

Anonymous

Thanks for writing.

By the way, the use of the term "smacking" is one which in some English speaking countries means the same as "spanking."

Samuel Martin

Lelia Schott said...

I enjoyed this article. Thank You Samuel for sharing truth and light. It can be difficult for some people to hear. But I like it because you are reaching people and softening their hearts to be more like Jesus.You are helping people see the importance of treating children with respect and honoring each other in the home for our authenticity. To me that is the greatest gift you could give anyone. Thank You

TealRose said...

austin .... where in your Bible do you find Christ telling us to hit our children? Christ died on the cross for us ALL, he brought grace to us ALL not just to adults. Children should be treated like the precious souls they are, and not hit into submission. Christ warned us not to make our children stumble, or it would be better to have a millstone put about our necks and thrown into the sea. He told us that to enter heaven we had to become as a child. What therefore makes you believe that somehow He would say that on one hand, and think children are somehow evil creatures that need knocking into shape on the other ? Respect needs to be given to children .. and hitting is not respectful. You want it, you think you 'deserve' it then give it first. You can't hurt ie hit and love, it's just not possible. Ask any adult that has been hit by their spouse. As much as you may THINK and feel you love that little one, if you hit them ... that is not a loving nor gentle nor right thing to do.

Thank you Samuel for showing us so clearly how Christ never intended for children to be hit !